[eranrund]

Keep in mind that 1010 only works because the tank is sitting on an additional 3/4" plywood cut to the foot print of the tank. You can still use the 1515, but I would re-build the frame above the fittings area and let it hit the floor in between the fittings. Be sure to give yourself room to work those fittings. I think a little more 1515, a few cuts on the miter saw, and more L-brackets is better than increasing the height of the tank by 1.25" with stacked plywood. Every inch counts in a van. I used 1515 for my bed platform and to encase my refrigerator. I encased my 140 pounds of lithium batteries with 1010. I call it "the battery jail".

View attachment 166225

Yup, that is the current plan. Going to stick with 1515 everywhere just to simplify my hoarding of stock material, brackets and fasteners...
My lithium battery is around ~200-250lbs, so I am certainly going to go all out with anchoring it down.

 

[eranrund]

Yesterday I drilled another hole in the van, this time for passing cables to the roof. At the very least, I need to run cables for the following:

• Solar panels
• Front, rear and side LED lights
• Rear view camera (I want one thats active when I am driving)
• Cellular antenna, although that might go on the other side of the van, we'll see).

My solution is a In the previous van I ran only a single 24v high gauge cable to the roof, plus an ethernet cable (8 conductors) and had relays on the roof to control power to the lights. I might do the same here, which is why I went with a (probably oversized) polycarbonate enclosure, combined with a PVC bulkhead fitting. This will leave me with plenty of room to pass as many wires as I want. The plastic enclosure is glued to the roof using 3M 4200 fast cure sealant/adhesive. I think I will follow up with some Dicor lap sealant around the enclosure later this week, although that is probably overkill.

When I was done with that I went ahead and glued 1/8" neoprene foam over the roof ribs, following what @natecostello and his partner did in their build. I don't know how much of a difference this will make, but its cheap and low effort. I will be doing this on most exposed van sheet metal.

Cheers!

 

[Bajabound]

Just curious.
1) What will you be attaching with the 2 plus nuts? Are they in factory holes or did you drill them?
2) Is that 1 inch or 1.5 inch foam board?
3) What is the rational behind the two types of insulation? I know everyone has an opinion on insulation, but I have not seen that combo before.
4) What was used to secure the foam board to the ceiling?

 

[eranrund]

Just curious. What will you be attaching with the 2 plus nuts? Are they in factory holes or did you drill them?

They are factory holes. I am probably not using the two center ones - that was from a previous plan of attaching furring strips. The current plan is to attach 8020 pieces. Here's a photo from yesterday where I experimented with sticking a 1/4" baltic bitch panel in the 8020 slots as part of my ceiling plan:

The 8020 pieces going front to back and holding the panel are held by the plus nuts.

 

[Bajabound]

NICE, very utilitarian. What is the plan for the sides?
1) Did you use an L bracket bolted into the plusnut or did you drill through the 8020 and bolt into the plusnut?
2) How level are those ceiling van ribs and do you have a slight bend in the 8020?

 

[eranrund]

The sides will have cabinets, as well as a shower on the driver side. I don't yet have a clear plan of how thats all going to look but I am hoping that it will be possible to create a nice finish. I am more concerned about the front of the vehicle where all the angles come into play all at once.
I did not use an L bracket - I drilled access holes in the 8020. I used SS 1/4-20 button head screws, with a SS washer and a nylon washer inside the upper 8020 channel, and an oversized nylon washer above the 8020 so that it does not touch the van's metal.
The ceiling ribs are not level, and as much the 8020 are at a bit of an angle. I expect this to cause me a headache down the line. Now that you mentioned L brackets, I am wondering if perhaps a slightly bent L bracket or a similar solution would not be superior. It will change the spacing between the pieces, but that might be fine for my plan.

 

[Bajabound]

The sides will have cabinets, as well as a shower on the driver side. I don't yet have a clear plan of how thats all going to look but I am hoping that it will be possible to create a nice finish. I am more concerned about the front of the vehicle where all the angles come into play all at once.
I did not use an L bracket - I drilled access holes in the 8020. I used SS 1/4-20 button head screws, with a SS washer and a nylon washer inside the upper 8020 channel, and an oversized nylon washer above the 8020 so that it does not touch the van's metal.
The ceiling ribs are not level, and as much the 8020 are at a bit of an angle. I expect this to cause me a headache down the line. Now that you mentioned L brackets, I am wondering if perhaps a slightly bent L bracket or a similar solution would not be superior. It will change the spacing between the pieces, but that might be fine for my plan.

Consider using the L brackets that have the elongated slot on one side. 8020 Part # 4295. This way you can give yourself some verticle room to play with to help ajust out the un-level ceiling ribs. I got this idea from this video at the 6 min mark. Also if the factory holes are out of square and thus the plusnuts, this may help to square up your 8020 bars front to back. I have yet to tackel overhead cabinets and it is just these un-resolved chalenges that have helped me to keep finding other stuff to focus on.

Sighning off from south and over the hill in Santa Cruz County.

 

[eranrund]

Consider using the L brackets that have the elongated slot on one side. 8020 Part # 4295. This way you can give yourself some verticle room to play with to help ajust out the un-level ceiling ribs. I got this idea from this video at the 6 min mark. Also if the factory holes are out of square and thus the plusnuts, this may help to square up your 8020 bars front to back. I have yet to tackel overhead cabinets and it is just these un-resolved chalenges that have helped me to keep finding other stuff to focus on.

Sighning off from south and over the hill in Santa Cruz County.

I think I will need a bracket that is not 90 degrees if I want the bottom of the 8020 to be parallel to the floor. I do think that front to back plus nuts are all at the same position, which is either a miracle or not actually the case...
And lol I get what you're saying, my progress has been very slow due to everything having a bunch of unresolved challenges and also everything depending on everything else and have to be done in the correct order. I realized yesterday that I need to take off the beams anyway, because I first need to finish covering the sheet metal at the rear, above the doors and the beams are currently in the way. So now I need to figure out what to do (leaning towards neoprene topped with the "standard" tweed fabric everyone else uses). Never upholstered a thing in my life so I am sure I am in for some lessons...

Cheers! Enjoy the hill Signing off from Oakland (but not Oakland Hills unfortunately)

 

[Jacek]

They are factory holes. I am probably not using the two center ones - that was from a previous plan of attaching furring strips. The current plan is to attach 8020 pieces. Here's a photo from yesterday where I experimented with sticking a 1/4" baltic bitch panel in the 8020 slots as part of my ceiling plan:

View attachment 166998

The 8020 pieces going front to back and holding the panel are held by the plus nuts.

Your ceiling is a brave and unconventional departure from the previous approaches that I have seen. I am interested in the progression and the end result.

 

[eranrund]

Your ceiling is a brave and unconventional departure from the previous approaches that I have seen. I am interested in the progression and the end result.

I too am interested in how this will turn out. Keeping my fingers crossed that it will all add up nicely.
The closet build where I recall seeing something similar is @gregoryx's - see here.

 

[orton]

For the top 80/20 extrusion for my upper cabinets, I bolted an angle to the side of the roof rib. Then to get thermal isolation I made a 3 hole 1/2" plywood plate. Top single hole bolted to the angle and the two bottom holes bolted to the side of the 80/20.

The Macrolux twin wall ceiling just lays on top of the 80/20 extrusion on each side. Think I made 2 1/4" spacers for the Transit rib center hole that I used to bolt the ceiling in place. Total of 4 bolts. Ceiling is level.

Details:

Ceiling | Orton Travel Transit (ortontransit.info)

 

[Bajabound]

I think I will need a bracket that is not 90 degrees if I want the bottom of the 8020 to be parallel to the floor.

Cheers! Enjoy the hill Signing off from Oakland (but not Oakland Hills unfortunately)

I think I watched someone overcome that by using the miter saw to cut a angled spacer. Just an idea. Truth is I have yet to tackel the project, so I have no experiance just ideas.

 

[gregoryx]

Edit: just barfed on your build thread. I'll kill this and move it to mine if you like.


I was concerned about the non-square aspects of the ceiling extrusions AND the wall extrusions (even /closer/ to square t the floor... but not square).

I'm super, super happy with the way we ended up doing it. And yours would work even better than ours because you don't have the angle-brackets on the ceiling extrusions. I /thought/ I'd posted this stuff, but it doesn't look like it's posted in our build thread. I'll have to address that.

You're already right-on with the 1/4" sheet inserted into the roof extrusions in the middle. Just pull those up with bolts through them into your rivnuts and you're good to go, obviously. Ours is pulled up with wood screws into 1x2 pieces that are held up with the rivnuts. Your only challenge here will be that you /might/ need/want a spacer depending how tight the panel pulls up with your setup. I, for one, think you should /not make it square to the floor; the center screws pull it up into a slightly dome-shaped setup and that looks better, I think; and the angled extrusions help that happen - with the shape of the roof.

Wherever there are roof seams, there will need to be a cover to tie them to each other. We used 1/2" baltic birch routed to clean it up a bit. I figured it would be temporary; but have grown to like it. As you know by now, this is the easy part. Yours will turn out looking even better than ours.

Okay... on to the part I'm super stoked about. First tested it on the front of the driver's side and it seemed viable. Then executed it on the passenger rear and it's better than expected. The small section of roof between the wall is stuck into the slot of the roof extrusion (just like the center panel - though ours had to be cut since we have brackets there and yours will not). Then the upper wall piece (which covers the electrical cables - get rid of that plastic cover on the driver's side) drops into the bottom rail and duo-lock velcros to the upper wall, which holds the ceiling piece in place.

In this photo, I took the panel back off to show how it's held on at the top.

Here's the side panel. Duo lock on the top, these z-clips on the bottom. Initially, we were going to screw the z-clips on but they held great with just VHB. That much cleaner. They have thick UHMW tape on the bottom where they drop into the extrusion slots to assure they don't rattle. We went with making these side panels flush with the extrusion so they would be clean as the back of the cabinets as well as look clean where exposed.

Here's the panel installed. Super clean. It holds the ceiling section up with a perfect seam - even though the top is actually hanging loose until the side panel goes in and the side panel is just resting in the slot then duolock holds it in at the top. Super maintainable to get back behind the cover. Remove cabinets, pull the panel off. No rattles observed, either - which is primarily why the Thinsulate is there.

Then bolt the cabinets up and it's clean as can be. I still have to decide how I'm doing the lower section (probably fabric wrapped) but you're probably on a cleaner route there than we are - since we did the 1/2" ply setup behind everything and you won't have that problem.

Cabinets are also in the, "so proud of how clever we are," category. They ONLY bolt to the rails using 90-degree angles between the extrusions where the angles are allowed to pivot. This is true at all three cabinet heights and depths: meeting the side and top rails (back cabinet); just past side and top (middle cabinet); and extended beyond and below the side and top (front-most cabinets).

Here's a shot where you can see the middle and front. The rear in this was an even smaller one that we abandoned. It's a little hard to envision... but every point where the cabinet connects to the top or side rails is able to be pivoted /just a bit/ to accommodate the non-square-ness. End results: cabinets at perfectly squared-up angles and only need to cut the side-panels to accommodate any minor changes.

Here's the passenger side before installing the outlets and without doors or sides on the middle cabinet.

Yeah... I need to put this in our build thread. Hope that was helpful. Or... just me blathering, I guess. 😏 🤣

 

[eranrund]

I think I watched someone overcome that by using the miter saw to cut a angled spacer. Just an idea. Truth is I have yet to tackel the project, so I have no experiance just ideas.

This is doable but tricky, since without an "opposing" spacer, the bolt head will be going against the angled surface, not evenly touching it. The L brackets idea will be easier in that regard but it will occupy the side of the extrusion which will interfere with the ceiling panels, so its a tradeoff.

Edit: just barfed on your build thread. I'll kill this and move it to mine if you like.


I was concerned about the non-square aspects of the ceiling extrusions AND the wall extrusions (even /closer/ to square t the floor... but not square).

I'm super, super happy with the way we ended up doing it. And yours would work even better than ours because you don't have the angle-brackets on the ceiling extrusions. I /thought/ I'd posted this stuff, but it doesn't look like it's posted in our build thread. I'll have to address that.

You're already right-on with the 1/4" sheet inserted into the roof extrusions in the middle. Just pull those up with bolts through them into your rivnuts and you're good to go, obviously. Ours is pulled up with wood screws into 1x2 pieces that are held up with the rivnuts. Your only challenge here will be that you /might/ need/want a spacer depending how tight the panel pulls up with your setup. I, for one, think you should /not make it square to the floor; the center screws pull it up into a slightly dome-shaped setup and that looks better, I think; and the angled extrusions help that happen - with the shape of the roof.
View attachment 167023

Wherever there are roof seams, there will need to be a cover to tie them to each other. We used 1/2" baltic birch routed to clean it up a bit. I figured it would be temporary; but have grown to like it. As you know by now, this is the easy part. Yours will turn out looking even better than ours.
View attachment 167025

Okay... on to the part I'm super stoked about. First tested it on the front of the driver's side and it seemed viable. Then executed it on the passenger rear and it's better than expected. The small section of roof between the wall is stuck into the slot of the roof extrusion (just like the center panel - though ours had to be cut since we have brackets there and yours will not). Then the upper wall piece (which covers the electrical cables - get rid of that plastic cover on the driver's side) drops into the bottom rail and duo-lock velcros to the upper wall, which holds the ceiling piece in place.

In this photo, I took the panel back off to show how it's held on at the top.
View attachment 167026

Here's the side panel. Duo lock on the top, these z-clips on the bottom. Initially, we were going to screw the z-clips on but they held great with just VHB. That much cleaner. They have thick UHMW tape on the bottom where they drop into the extrusion slots to assure they don't rattle. We went with making these side panels flush with the extrusion so they would be clean as the back of the cabinets as well as look clean where exposed.
View attachment 167027

Here's the panel installed. Super clean. It holds the ceiling section up with a perfect seam - even though the top is actually hanging loose until the side panel goes in and the side panel is just resting in the slot then duolock holds it in at the top. Super maintainable to get back behind the cover. Remove cabinets, pull the panel off. No rattles observed, either - which is primarily why the Thinsulate is there.
View attachment 167029

Then bolt the cabinets up and it's clean as can be. I still have to decide how I'm doing the lower section (probably fabric wrapped) but you're probably on a cleaner route there than we are - since we did the 1/2" ply setup behind everything and you won't have that problem.
View attachment 167030

Cabinets are also in the, "so proud of how clever we are," category. They ONLY bolt to the rails using 90-degree angles between the extrusions where the angles are allowed to pivot. This is true at all three cabinet heights and depths: meeting the side and top rails (back cabinet); just past side and top (middle cabinet); and extended beyond and below the side and top (front-most cabinets).

Here's a shot where you can see the middle and front. The rear in this was an even smaller one that we abandoned. It's a little hard to envision... but every point where the cabinet connects to the top or side rails is able to be pivoted /just a bit/ to accommodate the non-square-ness. End results: cabinets at perfectly squared-up angles and only need to cut the side-panels to accommodate any minor changes.
View attachment 167035

Here's the passenger side before installing the outlets and without doors or sides on the middle cabinet.
View attachment 167037


Yeah... I need to put this in our build thread. Hope that was helpful. Or... just me blathering, I guess. 😏 🤣

This was helpful! Thank you. I don't mind it being on my thread - but I do think you should also put it on yours
Your result is super clean! I like your different-sized overhead cabinets, and it's good to know that the angle of the long beams was not an issue. I agree that a curved ceiling will look better, but is harder to accomplish (I think? getting more bolts to align is always a pain for me). I see you placed your long rails closer to the side walls than I did, which makes it possible to have the narrower cabinets, and a smaller "side ceiling" panel (the ones you showed with the velcro and Z clips). I'll need to think about that since I do like the end result.

My current plan for attaching my ceiling panel so it doesn't rattle is perhaps overly complicated. I just ordered brackets that look like this:

The idea is that they sit on top of the long extrusion pieces and are bolted using that big hole to the extrusion. Then a wooden spacer that has a thread insert in the middle is bolted under the extrusion, and the ceiling panel bolts to that (if I manage to get the holes to align - seriously hate that part of the build...)

Perhaps this sketch explains it better:

On one hand I like the idea of bolting the panel closer to the center so that it will end up curved, but I also like the idea of only having fasteners close to the extrusion and not in the center of the panel. Separately, with my 8020 beam being ~37" away from each other, the 1/4" BB ceiling panel is too rigid to bend in any meaningful way. To get it into the 8020 slot I had to creep on it with the tablesaw until it was just a tad bit wider than the space between the inner slot of the extrusion and the outer slot on the opposite side:

This allowed me to snap it in and then carefully adjust it so it is still hanging inside the slot on both sides. I started with a panel that was the full width between the inner parts, but that was not going to happen. I think if I wanted a domed ceiling I will have to move the beams closer to the walls like you did, and maybe that will give the panel enough flex. @gregoryx did you use baltic birch for the 1/4" panel or perhaps a different type of plywood that is lighter/more flexible? Do you have any tips on how to get the dimensions right, and how to accurately locate the fastener holes?

A big TBD is what I am going to finish the panel with, and how the potential extra thickness will affect things. I am currently debating the following options:

1. Landau foam + tweed fabric - this is likely the lightest and easiest to do, although I have never upholstered a thing in my life. This will be a good opportunity to learn as the shape and cut outs are fairly simple. I think seam between panels with this trim will be elegant and not require a trim piece.
2. Decorative laminate (Formica or such). Ordered a bunch of samples of Wilsonart from Home Depot last night to evaluate. I do like the cabin in the woods look but I am not sure this will give that to me or just look cheap. Also a fairly light option and should be easy to execute on. This will require a trim piece between the panels.
3. Figure out a way to do tongue and groove cedar paneling. This will be the most labor intensive and likely heavy. I do like how it looks, and thats what I did for my previous van. Current thought on that route is instead of having a 1/4" BB panel, I will build a panel out of the tongue and groove planks, with some backing cross pieces to hold it together. That might actually end up being more flexible than the 1/4" BB piece I experimented with, which might make it easier to work with?

Thank you and cheers!

 

[orton]

Another thought that might be useful:

My ceiling panel rests on top of the 80/20 and not in the slot. Made it about 1" wider than the distance between the extrusions so I could get it up between the extrusions and then slide it sideways so panel overlaps the 80/20 1/2" on each side. That way the slot is still usable for other attachments.

The panel is only bolted to the van rib at the center of the van rib. The unbolted edges do not rattle.

 

[gregoryx]

This is doable but tricky, since without an "opposing" spacer, the bolt head will be going against the angled surface, not evenly touching it. The L brackets idea will be easier in that regard but it will occupy the side of the extrusion which will interfere with the ceiling panels, so its a tradeoff.

I saw some vanlife vendor selling an angle-aluminum (or maybe steel?) piece made to perfectly match the ceiling/wall of the Transit. I was thinking it was AVC, but I don't see it on their site. Ugh. Should have saved the link. But it's out there! And it was like $155 for the kit or something very reasonable like that.

This was helpful! Thank you. I don't mind it being on my thread - but I do think you should also put it on yours
Your result is super clean! I like your different-sized overhead cabinets, and it's good to know that the angle of the long beams was not an issue. I agree that a curved ceiling will look better, but is harder to accomplish (I think? getting more bolts to align is always a pain for me). I see you placed your long rails closer to the side walls than I did, which makes it possible to have the narrower cabinets, and a smaller "side ceiling" panel (the ones you showed with the velcro and Z clips). I'll need to think about that since I do like the end result.

My current plan for attaching my ceiling panel so it doesn't rattle is perhaps overly complicated. I just ordered brackets that look like this:
View attachment 167078
The idea is that they sit on top of the long extrusion pieces and are bolted using that big hole to the extrusion. Then a wooden spacer that has a thread insert in the middle is bolted under the extrusion, and the ceiling panel bolts to that (if I manage to get the holes to align - seriously hate that part of the build...)

Perhaps this sketch explains it better:
View attachment 167079

On one hand I like the idea of bolting the panel closer to the center so that it will end up curved, but I also like the idea of only having fasteners close to the extrusion and not in the center of the panel. Separately, with my 8020 beam being ~37" away from each other, the 1/4" BB ceiling panel is too rigid to bend in any meaningful way. To get it into the 8020 slot I had to creep on it with the tablesaw until it was just a tad bit wider than the space between the inner slot of the extrusion and the outer slot on the opposite side:
View attachment 167080
This allowed me to snap it in and then carefully adjust it so it is still hanging inside the slot on both sides. I started with a panel that was the full width between the inner parts, but that was not going to happen. I think if I wanted a domed ceiling I will have to move the beams closer to the walls like you did, and maybe that will give the panel enough flex. @gregoryx did you use baltic birch for the 1/4" panel or perhaps a different type of plywood that is lighter/more flexible? Do you have any tips on how to get the dimensions right, and how to accurately locate the fastener holes?

A big TBD is what I am going to finish the panel with, and how the potential extra thickness will affect things. I am currently debating the following options:

1. Landau foam + tweed fabric - this is likely the lightest and easiest to do, although I have never upholstered a thing in my life. This will be a good opportunity to learn as the shape and cut outs are fairly simple. I think seam between panels with this trim will be elegant and not require a trim piece.
2. Decorative laminate (Formica or such). Ordered a bunch of samples of Wilsonart from Home Depot last night to evaluate. I do like the cabin in the woods look but I am not sure this will give that to me or just look cheap. Also a fairly light option and should be easy to execute on. This will require a trim piece between the panels.
3. Figure out a way to do tongue and groove cedar paneling. This will be the most labor intensive and likely heavy. I do like how it looks, and thats what I did for my previous van. Current thought on that route is instead of having a 1/4" BB panel, I will build a panel out of the tongue and groove planks, with some backing cross pieces to hold it together. That might actually end up being more flexible than the 1/4" BB piece I experimented with, which might make it easier to work with?

Thank you and cheers!

Yeah.... I'll take what I did on your thread and get it into mine! 😄

The material we used for the ceiling is 1/4" melamine-coated MDF. This is a page of the type of stuff we used from a local shop. We're using finished birch of similar stuff for the side panels. I'm surprised if yours seem to have no flex at 1/4 for BB ply; ours flex, though not much.

I see what you're aiming for on the ceiling mounts... but I'm pretty confident that leaving 3 feet across will leave a lot of flex on the 1/4" panel. I'd expect to pull it up in the middle somehow - whether just to keep it flat or to curve it. We did the 1x2 in the middle but you could just go straight into your rivnuts as well. You might run into what we did: we cut the panel to fit flat across then it pulled right out of the slots when we pulled it up tight in the middle. Had to start over with a wider panel and loosen all the bolts so everything was "floating" while putting it all together. That got it to still have enough in the slots while pulling up in the middle. IOW, it was overly-wide so that the finished pulled-up was the right width.

For us to get the center panel to fit into place, we had the bolts all loose on the ceiling extrusions - to the point of just hanging loose. Two of us held the ceiling panel up/in while tightening a combination of the extrusion bolts and something like 3" wood-screws up into the 1x2 cross mounts. Then we altered between bringing the center UP by tightening, then replacing the 3" with 2" and less and tightening the long extrusions. End result was no squeaking and it pulls up a bit in the middle. If it didn't pull up, I think it wouldn't have the tension to keep it from squeaking and rattling.

Having done panels-in-the-slot on the last van, we knew they were super rattle-y... so knew we'd need a lot of tension to keep them from rattling. Considered the "on top" (as Orton mentions) or "on bottom" but was hoping for the super-clean look that we ended up with - just enough to bolt to the slots without much more. Only a few screws show. Those screws are no attractive ones... but I /intend/ to use attractive screws if I find some. 😁


As far as holes aligning... as described, I think the key is for everything to be loosely assembled then tightened together as a unit by alternating each fastener point. This allows for all the pieces to find their best fit with each other without trying to shove things too much. It's just a bit difficult to get them all started... then easy once started. The holes in the ceiling panels are larger than the wood-screws (washers in use) so that we could move around the screw to find our preferred location to screw into.

The space from the wall to our roof extrusions is about 7-8" per side (varies with the shape of the van). The center is something like 44-48" (don't have it here to check). I think the distance to the walls turned out well - the shallowest cabinets at the back are that depth. It would be easy enough to bring a mount /back/ from a further-out extrusion but might not look as clean.


FTR, the "side ceiling" panels don't have any duo-lock or anything holding them. They slide into the slots on the rails, then the small side-wall pieces hold them UP with pressure once they're pushed in. The Thinsulate behind the upper panels (like the side panels) creates pressure DOWN and the side piece holds it UP. Then the side-piece is held in place by the duo-lock velcro on the top (and the z-clip tabs in the extrusion on the bottom). Tried a bunch of ideas on this. Threw away a bunch of cuts of wood and wasted other hardware. Ended up with this setup that uses zero hardware for the top panel, only z-clips and duo-lock for the side, and relys on the pressure between them all to keep it solid. Thanks to a decent table-saw cut on the side-panels it's a perfect seam in the corner without any challenging cuts or angles. Way cleaner than forcing it with bolts and angles was looking like it would be. I should try sketching it... I never got a decent photo that makes it clear how it works.


We had planned to fabric-finish the side panels; but they look so clean in finished birch (and the perfect melamine seam with that birch) that we're just keeping them as-is. After the ceiling experience, I really wanted to find a way to do clean panels on everything else (cabinets and wall-panels with extrusions). With as little exposed hardware as possible. We figured it out on the cabinets and are now applying it to the wall panels as well: everything with a panel is using duo-lock onto z-clips and 90-angles so EVERY panel (cabinet and wall) is a pull-off with zero hardware. Only exception is hinged doors - which all have exposed hinges and locks.

But pretty sure our metal surfaces will be foam-and-fabric. Just gotta get off my butt and spend a day doing the first one BADLY so I can do the second one SO-SO then go back and tear out the first one to do it DECENT with the hopes of that leading to PRETTY GOOD on the rest! 😁



Gotta admit, though... could just do panels all the way across and put the extrusions on top of the panels. Super simple. That's what we did with a buddy's ceiling: panels all the way across with the middle anchors pulling them up. Amazing how clean it looks. Cleaner than ours. (Can't find a photo.) Then they'll put the extrusions on top to hold cabinets - as @orton describes)

 

[eranrund]

Another thought that might be useful:

My ceiling panel rests on top of the 80/20 and not in the slot. Made it about 1" wider than the distance between the extrusions so I could get it up between the extrusions and then slide it sideways so panel overlaps the 80/20 1/2" on each side. That way the slot is still usable for other attachments.

The panel is only bolted to the van rib at the center of the van rib. The unbolted edges do not rattle.

That would likely work, but I have to say that I like the aesthetic of the panel-inside-the-slot. Agreed that it is less functional and takes up the slot and some height.

I saw some vanlife vendor selling an angle-aluminum (or maybe steel?) piece made to perfectly match the ceiling/wall of the Transit. I was thinking it was AVC, but I don't see it on their site. Ugh. Should have saved the link. But it's out there! And it was like $155 for the kit or something very reasonable like that.




Yeah.... I'll take what I did on your thread and get it into mine! 😄

The material we used for the ceiling is 1/4" melamine-coated MDF. This is a page of the type of stuff we used from a local shop. We're using finished birch of similar stuff for the side panels. I'm surprised if yours seem to have no flex at 1/4 for BB ply; ours flex, though not much.

I see what you're aiming for on the ceiling mounts... but I'm pretty confident that leaving 3 feet across will leave a lot of flex on the 1/4" panel. I'd expect to pull it up in the middle somehow - whether just to keep it flat or to curve it. We did the 1x2 in the middle but you could just go straight into your rivnuts as well. You might run into what we did: we cut the panel to fit flat across then it pulled right out of the slots when we pulled it up tight in the middle. Had to start over with a wider panel and loosen all the bolts so everything was "floating" while putting it all together. That got it to still have enough in the slots while pulling up in the middle. IOW, it was overly-wide so that the finished pulled-up was the right width.

For us to get the center panel to fit into place, we had the bolts all loose on the ceiling extrusions - to the point of just hanging loose. Two of us held the ceiling panel up/in while tightening a combination of the extrusion bolts and something like 3" wood-screws up into the 1x2 cross mounts. Then we altered between bringing the center UP by tightening, then replacing the 3" with 2" and less and tightening the long extrusions. End result was no squeaking and it pulls up a bit in the middle. If it didn't pull up, I think it wouldn't have the tension to keep it from squeaking and rattling.

Having done panels-in-the-slot on the last van, we knew they were super rattle-y... so knew we'd need a lot of tension to keep them from rattling. Considered the "on top" (as Orton mentions) or "on bottom" but was hoping for the super-clean look that we ended up with - just enough to bolt to the slots without much more. Only a few screws show. Those screws are no attractive ones... but I /intend/ to use attractive screws if I find some. 😁


As far as holes aligning... as described, I think the key is for everything to be loosely assembled then tightened together as a unit by alternating each fastener point. This allows for all the pieces to find their best fit with each other without trying to shove things too much. It's just a bit difficult to get them all started... then easy once started. The holes in the ceiling panels are larger than the wood-screws (washers in use) so that we could move around the screw to find our preferred location to screw into.

The space from the wall to our roof extrusions is about 7-8" per side (varies with the shape of the van). The center is something like 44-48" (don't have it here to check). I think the distance to the walls turned out well - the shallowest cabinets at the back are that depth. It would be easy enough to bring a mount /back/ from a further-out extrusion but might not look as clean.


FTR, the "side ceiling" panels don't have any duo-lock or anything holding them. They slide into the slots on the rails, then the small side-wall pieces hold them UP with pressure once they're pushed in. The Thinsulate behind the upper panels (like the side panels) creates pressure DOWN and the side piece holds it UP. Then the side-piece is held in place by the duo-lock velcro on the top (and the z-clip tabs in the extrusion on the bottom). Tried a bunch of ideas on this. Threw away a bunch of cuts of wood and wasted other hardware. Ended up with this setup that uses zero hardware for the top panel, only z-clips and duo-lock for the side, and relys on the pressure between them all to keep it solid. Thanks to a decent table-saw cut on the side-panels it's a perfect seam in the corner without any challenging cuts or angles. Way cleaner than forcing it with bolts and angles was looking like it would be. I should try sketching it... I never got a decent photo that makes it clear how it works.


We had planned to fabric-finish the side panels; but they look so clean in finished birch (and the perfect melamine seam with that birch) that we're just keeping them as-is. After the ceiling experience, I really wanted to find a way to do clean panels on everything else (cabinets and wall-panels with extrusions). With as little exposed hardware as possible. We figured it out on the cabinets and are now applying it to the wall panels as well: everything with a panel is using duo-lock onto z-clips and 90-angles so EVERY panel (cabinet and wall) is a pull-off with zero hardware. Only exception is hinged doors - which all have exposed hinges and locks.

But pretty sure our metal surfaces will be foam-and-fabric. Just gotta get off my butt and spend a day doing the first one BADLY so I can do the second one SO-SO then go back and tear out the first one to do it DECENT with the hopes of that leading to PRETTY GOOD on the rest! 😁



Gotta admit, though... could just do panels all the way across and put the extrusions on top of the panels. Super simple. That's what we did with a buddy's ceiling: panels all the way across with the middle anchors pulling them up. Amazing how clean it looks. Cleaner than ours. (Can't find a photo.) Then they'll put the extrusions on top to hold cabinets - as @orton describes)

Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed reply!
I am surprised that your experience was that 3ft provides enough flex. Maybe I am running into issues because I am using the full 8ft length of the panel as a single piece.
I am not yet ready to give up the panel-in-the-slot configuration for the panel-on-top-of-extrusion solution @orton suggested. What I like about the panel in slot in the version I was going for (the non-domed one that might end up being too rattly even with my side-bracket idea mentioned above) is that if it does work, it makes removing the ceiling panel super easy.
I do like that in your configuration the center piece is <48". That means I could use a 4x8 sheet pretty efficiently. If it was any wider then I would need more panels. To be fair, like everything else here, that is also a tradeoff. Maneuvering a 8ft long panel into place is a pain, especially by myself.
I'm gonna have to read this all again and internalize what you did with the duo-lock and z-clips. The less visible fasteners I can have, the better I will feel about the end result.

I am about to go through the exact same process that you mentioned with the foam-and-fabric. Hopefully it won't be too bad. I saw a lot of people do just fabric over metal, but adding some 1/8" foam, if possible, seems superior to me. Tiny bit more insulation, and more pleasant if you hit your head against it.

Cheers!

 

[njvagabond]

I saw some vanlife vendor selling an angle-aluminum (or maybe steel?) piece made to perfectly match the ceiling/wall of the Transit. I was thinking it was AVC, but I don't see it on their site. Ugh. Should have saved the link. But it's out there! And it was like $155 for the kit or something very reasonable like that.

This?
Structural Assembly for Transit Van Panels

 

[gregoryx]

This?
Structural Assembly for Transit Van Panels

YES! Great find, @njvagabond. Didn't end up doing ours in a way that would be helpful; but it seems like it could be a great thing for many builds.

...
Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed reply!
I am surprised that your experience was that 3ft provides enough flex. Maybe I am running into issues because I am using the full 8ft length of the panel as a single piece.
I am not yet ready to give up the panel-in-the-slot configuration for the panel-on-top-of-extrusion solution @orton suggested. What I like about the panel in slot in the version I was going for (the non-domed one that might end up being too rattly even with my side-bracket idea mentioned above) is that if it does work, it makes removing the ceiling panel super easy.
I do like that in your configuration the center piece is <48". That means I could use a 4x8 sheet pretty efficiently. If it was any wider then I would need more panels. To be fair, like everything else here, that is also a tradeoff. Maneuvering a 8ft long panel into place is a pain, especially by myself.
I'm gonna have to read this all again and internalize what you did with the duo-lock and z-clips. The less visible fasteners I can have, the better I will feel about the end result.

I am about to go through the exact same process that you mentioned with the foam-and-fabric. Hopefully it won't be too bad. I saw a lot of people do just fabric over metal, but adding some 1/8" foam, if possible, seems superior to me. Tiny bit more insulation, and more pleasant if you hit your head against it.

Cheers!

Only reason we shortened our ceiling panels was to align with the ceiling / roof cross-member where our cross-piece was sitting. Might be six feet long? Just where they lined up wtih the cross-members best so that 1/2" x 4" strip would bolt in cleanly. Shouldn't matter, though... the flex shouldn't be affected by that. But, yeah... it would be TOUGH to do this solo. 🤔

But, yes, width is very close to 48" - pretty sure there was a small cut; just the way the long extrusions bolted best into the roof points.

I'll try to do a drawing or something to make more sense of how those corner panels - ceiling and upper-wall - come together. As I said, it was NOT a case of perfect genius on the first try but willing to throw away many hours of work and parts until it got better.

On the roof panels. If you like this look but want it to be easier... you can do the full-width ceiling panels (which really came out awesome on our buddy's rig and are super easy to make) then use the half-height 8020 slot - nearly same visible effect and much easier to put up. Basically the best of both worlds between the look of ours and Orton's install model of install.


My plan on the fabric-over-metal is to start with the driver's side rear door then the passenger's (then re-do the driver's side, most likely) - if they don't turn out as well... no big. I want to be half-decent before tackling the slider and the rest of the windows in ours. Going with hard-plastic tape (UMHW or whatever it's called) over all the slots and holes, then spray-on adhesive to mount foam (I have both landau and neoprene - not sure which) then spray-on for fabric - I have two types but think the tweed will be best. Undecided how I'll handle our transitions to 1/2" ply. We'll see... 🤞

 

[eranrund]

YES! Great find, @njvagabond. Didn't end up doing ours in a way that would be helpful; but it seems like it could be a great thing for many builds.



Only reason we shortened our ceiling panels was to align with the ceiling / roof cross-member where our cross-piece was sitting. Might be six feet long? Just where they lined up wtih the cross-members best so that 1/2" x 4" strip would bolt in cleanly. Shouldn't matter, though... the flex shouldn't be affected by that. But, yeah... it would be TOUGH to do this solo. 🤔

But, yes, width is very close to 48" - pretty sure there was a small cut; just the way the long extrusions bolted best into the roof points.

I'll try to do a drawing or something to make more sense of how those corner panels - ceiling and upper-wall - come together. As I said, it was NOT a case of perfect genius on the first try but willing to throw away many hours of work and parts until it got better.

On the roof panels. If you like this look but want it to be easier... you can do the full-width ceiling panels (which really came out awesome on our buddy's rig and are super easy to make) then use the half-height 8020 slot - nearly same visible effect and much easier to put up. Basically the best of both worlds between the look of ours and Orton's install model of install.


My plan on the fabric-over-metal is to start with the driver's side rear door then the passenger's (then re-do the driver's side, most likely) - if they don't turn out as well... no big. I want to be half-decent before tackling the slider and the rest of the windows in ours. Going with hard-plastic tape (UMHW or whatever it's called) over all the slots and holes, then spray-on adhesive to mount foam (I have both landau and neoprene - not sure which) then spray-on for fabric - I have two types but think the tweed will be best. Undecided how I'll handle our transitions to 1/2" ply. We'll see... 🤞

The full width ceiling panels and half-height 8020 pieces will be easier but has two issues I am not super excited about: The first is it means the ceiling is never coming down if I need to take it down, without disassembling all the upper cabinets and everything that bolted into the rails. The other is that while I can easily get 145" pieces of the full-height 8020, I am limited to ~94" pieces for the half ones. That means two pieces instead of one long piece. Neither of those things are horrible, but are tradeoffs for me to consider...

Good luck with the upholstering. I wouldn't count on being able to easily redo it - at least not the neoprene part if you use that. My experience after glueing it to the roof ribs is that it will be very annoying to remove it since it tears very easily. Might be a lot of work...

Goodluck!