[Janus9]

You are not alone with your comments. 80% of the negative comments on my conversion video are related to the method I use to get clean. It is interesting to me how people consider only a shower like at home to get clean. No deviation allowed. My objective was to get clean with as simple a method as possible, use the minimum amount of power, minimum amount of water, eliminate plumbing, minimize cost, shower inside and use the minimum amount of space.

Is it an enjoyable shower? No. Does it achieve my objectives? Yes. I get clean.

What is neat about conversions is everyone has different objectives so have different solutions.

Orton, I really appreciate your posts. You frequently approach problems from a different angle and your choices catch my attention.

The forum is definitely a better place with your contributions.

Can you post a link to that video?

 

[orton]

Agreed on that. And makes NO sense to me why someone would take the trouble to comment on your thread about what they dislike or how you should do YOUR deal your way. Different deal if you were telling them how to do their thing; but to comment on your thing about doing it their way? 😏

Certainly not telling anyone how to shower.

I think it is to everyone's advantage to read different solutions. We can all learn from each other.

I had a workable shower solution in this build. Then someone on the Sprinter site said he used a Sous Vide water heater. I never knew such an item existed. I thought I had a good solution but his idea was better so I copied it.

Hopefully some posts by people in your thread could be useful to others.

 

[orton]

Orton, I really appreciate your posts. You frequently approach problems from a different angle and your choices catch my attention.

The forum is definitely a better place with your contributions.

Can you post a link to that video?

Retired engineer builds transforming, off-grid, stealth campervan - YouTube

Please no comments about how idiotic the shower is. I already have a complete collection.

I did not write the title. Hardly transforming or stealth.

The web site is: ortontransit.info

I apologize to gregoryx for getting off base in his thread. No more posts.

 

[gregoryx]

Haven't seen the video before, Dave. I'll check it out tomorrow. Off-base / off-track / off-topic? That's the sub-title for this whole forum! All good. But doesn't mean I won't harass you.

 

[JMBoise]

Thanks, @eranrund. I've enjoyed perusing your thread as well! Sharing all the ideas makes cool stuff happen. 😄



Agreed on the windows stuff. Had a couple friends climb in the van last night and commented that it seems more spacious than some small RVs. An illusion, of course, but the windows and the offsets on walls / cabinets / windows help with that illusion, I think.

The width savings is an interesting one. We pondered this on the previous van as well. There's a hidden advantage to the N-S setup: the mattress sits into the rear door-frame by 8-9" (potentially 10" depending how the mattress rests against the rear pillars). A queen mattress is 60x80 (that's what we're running). So switching sideways is clearly 20". But it's actually only 10-12" in final use. Then there's the fact that you /can't/ get a queen mattress E-W - the max is about 75" without pop-outs. Add pop-outs and you can /maybe/ get the 80"? But sacrifice insulation options - not a /really/ big deal compared to windows, but it's a thing. Without pop-outs, you're down to a 5-7" difference. And now you either have to go with a Full mattress (54x75) or go to a custom-cut foam. I prefer an actual, comfortable mattress - not just "a really good RV setup." So... 🤷‍♀️

At minimum, the savings with a queen mattress is 12".

Then there's the raise/lower bed thing: a bed going E-W pretty much has to be in the window insets - can't sit partially in the rear door, again. Meaning the up/down function is down to less than a foot. That's not so great for garage space. We moved a couch last night: put the bed on high and tons of room. So that alone pretty much seals it for us.

If we build one in the future, I'll re-consider a shorter rig. Maybe I'll change my mind on the N-S/E-W. But with the raise-lower thing, probably end up back on N-S. But it will certainly be a re-consider if we were in the shorter rig. 🤔

Thanks for the great info. Yes it looks like having a fixed garage E-W set up might limit your elevation options, also would have more linear under bed storage going N-S Probably going to put my kitchen near passenger side door and get two swing fold up jump seats behind driver's seat, concerned that kitchen might stick out too much at side door opening if I don't use the flares.

This company has windows all around and is pretty open looking, no garage which could be a problem.
Motorisés Série ProMaster – XL21’ XL PLUS

 

[surfgeezer]

Great build! Really like all the adaptability

 

[eranrund]

Would love to see more photos of the "Removable recirculating shower" module. It's time for me to start building mine and I very much like where yours is going.

 

[gregoryx]

...
This company has windows all around and is pretty open looking, no garage which could be a problem.
Motorisés Série ProMaster – XL21’ XL PLUS

Love the open windows look!

Great build! Really like all the adaptability

Thank you, @surfgeezer 😄

Would love to see more photos of the "Removable recirculating shower" module. It's time for me to start building mine and I very much like where yours is going.

Will do. I ran out of steam after the last big multi-day, long-hour push and it's waiting in the garage for me to revisit it. Just picked up Some Lexan sheets that I'm going to try to use as the walls.

I will try to flip it over and get some shots of the bottom / drain portion of it shortly. From there, I need to get walls on it before the water side makes any progress; nothing to attach the mixers to at this point!

 

[Bent1]

"...mountains are our Holy Land, and we ought to saunter through them reverently...”
View attachment 159423
View attachment 159452

1. Guiding Plan
2. Initial Order and Purchase
3. Overall build - floor, insulation, 8020, templates, etc.
4. Bed - electric raise / lower plus 'couch mode'
5. Galley - oven, hot and cold water, fresh and gray storage, shower, and ESPRESSO!
6. Electrical - 8kWh 24V Victron spend-fest
7. Garage slider - the WHOLE garage slides out
8. Removable recirculating shower

Others (TBD):

• Refrigerator cabinet / mount (over electrical cabinet)
• Propane locker
• 20-gallon under-chassis fresh-water tank (currently functional but still a lot to do)
• On-board-air system - Viair 400P Automatic with 2.5-gallon tank
• Air Lift Load Lifter 5000 Ultimate with Wireless Kit
• Road Master Active Suspension - Heavy Duty kit

• MaxxAir fan rear install - the overkill install
• Scopema swivels on 2020 power / heated seats - how we protected the wire and raised the seat mounts
• Air compressor and tank - compressor for air up/down and bikes, tank for blowing things clean
• Propane locker - 3030 framed enclosure, vented, sealed with tape
• Upper cabinets - 3030 framed, hinged doors, latches, varied sizes - focus on things looking "spacious"
• 2-person seat - not comfortable for anyone other than children, runners and rock-climbers
• DIY roof rack - HPDE bases, angle aluminum uprights, 30mm aluminum structure (and why we're probably going to re-build it)
• Air Lift suspension with remote
• Lagun table mount by slider - table for swivels AND extra counter-top

More:

• Wall panels - attaching with Duo Lock velcro connecting - panels pop off, invisible attaching
• Bug screens for slider and rear - I've bought four but none seem right
• Cellular amp - in use but not "installed"
• Exterior lights - flood lights for camping and driving - still in the boxes
• Espar B4L install - in the box now, getting ready to mount behind driver's rear wheel
• Sound-bar and sub for music in the rig - ultimately for movies as well

The intro post:

I'm gonna put up a thread since I keep thinking I should. I'm going to try to document (with photos and parts lists) the things we did that aren't the standard stuff. So not as much attention paid to insulation, floor, swivels or solar panels - plenty of that here and elsewhere. Maybe a little bit on the aluminum extrusion model, though that's got plenty of traction as well (aka 8020).

I'll link to each post for the key build topics. Nudge me if I screw up or miss or skip something.

I'll do the "reserved post" for the first few and then just do the others as I get around to it.

If anything looks interesting but I haven't done it yet, nudge me; that's more fun than working off of my own "to do" list.



Planned but not executed at all yet - help me figure these out!

• Stereo upgrade - speakers and whatever... amps? DSP? don't know yet
• Finish work to pretty up the walls and doors and window openings - really lost on this
• Window covers - might just buy them if I can get over the price
• Bedliner cover on exterior lower plastic panels and rockers
• Wheel well liners
• Roof rack fairing
• Monitor / screen for watching movies in bed
• Floor-based vent to pull more air - or keep using the windows cracked?
• Front skid / bash plate
• Add RPI for remote access / monitoring

Love what you have done. I would love to duplicate your slide out and bed system as its one of the most functional I have seen to date.

 

[gregoryx]

Love what you have done. I would love to duplicate your slide out and bed system as its one of the most functional I have seen to date.

Thanks, @Bent1.

It's always about the, "what are your objectives" game, y'know? That "bring all the toys" thing for us makes the garage and slider a big focus. It creates limitations, of course: there's not much "fixed" space on the sides of the slider; it would be pretty tough to put the electrical system or any water storage in the back; probably other things, as well. But #1 target for us is all the gear that we're bringing for the adventure.

Looking forward to seeing how you do it!

 

[JMBoise]

Thanks, @Bent1.

It's always about the, "what are your objectives" game, y'know? That "bring all the toys" thing for us makes the garage and slider a big focus. It creates limitations, of course: there's not much "fixed" space on the sides of the slider; it would be pretty tough to put the electrical system or any water storage in the back; probably other things, as well. But #1 target for us is all the gear that we're bringing for the adventure.

Looking forward to seeing how you do it!

Really want open window design on a medium length build. Trying to figure out if I want to order cargo van with all around windows or go with flares. Flares look like a lot of work, install, painting exteriors....

Questions:
If it gets hot outside, do you plan to put baffles into windows?
Any plans for shore powered AC?
Where do you put all your toys when you sleep at night and it is raining? Pretty sure I can't get my bikes under fixed bed at window belt line.
Thanks!

 

[njvagabond]

Pretty sure I can't get my bikes under fixed bed at window belt line.

Laying them down is an option. Here is a really nice set up. Mtb’s & medium roof’s

 

[JMBoise]

got it njvagabond. Thanks!

 

[gregoryx]

Really want open window design on a medium length build. Trying to figure out if I want to order cargo van with all around windows or go with flares. Flares look like a lot of work, install, painting exteriors....

Questions:
If it gets hot outside, do you plan to put baffles into windows?
Any plans for shore powered AC?
Where do you put all your toys when you sleep at night and it is raining? Pretty sure I can't get my bikes under fixed bed at window belt line.
Thanks!

We had a very good experience with our own window-covers in the last rig - great in heat and cold - but haven't landed on exactly what we're going to do with this one. The last rig's window covers were corrugated plastic with Reflectix and magnets. Worked WAY better than we expected in heat and cold. (Pretty sure it's the space / gap it creates between the window and the material.) Currently, we're just using Reflectix with magnets. It's not terrible, but not nearly as good. Really want to do some nice fabric units - and have them fold down into the pockets below the windows - but not eager to sew them and haven't been willing to stomach the ~$2,000 for buying them! 😲

The moving bed is critical for our toys. We don't want to change or move anything at night. We have done two bikes laying down for the whole trip when things will fit (looking at you, @njvagabond 👀 ). Then the bed is nearly all the way down and it's great. But if we're running three bikes, that doesn't work or help. But since our bed moves, we just run it higher up.

A recent trip, my son was trying to get the best compromise and we ended up strapping down the front fork on the higher-travel bikes. It worried him that it might be bad for the fork, but we used to always transport motorcycles that way. 🤷‍♀️ And quite a bit of window space still available. Here is is with just the two bikes loaded. Testing to make sure the height worked before loading everything else (climbing gear, paddle-boards, food, etc)

 

[njvagabond]

(looking at you, @njvagabond 👀 ).

I settled on stand up bike storage and a fixed rear bed, since it can meet our requirement of being able to sit up in bed. Short people = short bikes + short bed + less headroom required. FTW

I do like the idea of being able to lift the bed out of the way to use the van for hauling, but in reality that would probably be very infrequent if at all for us. Plus the way our layout is there wont be a huge advantage to raising the bed. I will probably try to make the bed platform removable to start and see how that goes. No need for regular flexibility for gear storage.

That being said I am a huge fan of flexible configurations, it has been an incredible benefit in our Odysseys for the past 20 years. Don't know how we could have ever done a lot of the stuff he have over the years. In fact, on our last road trip and again just yesterday I ran it with the 3rd row folded into floor and one of the captains chairs removed. Was able to shuttle my parents to my nieces and a few bikes to my brothers in the same milk run.

 

[Codylane20]

Retired engineer builds transforming, off-grid, stealth campervan - YouTube

Please no comments about how idiotic the shower is. I already have a complete collection.

I did not write the title. Hardly transforming or stealth.

The web site is: ortontransit.info

I apologize to gregoryx for getting off base in his thread. No more posts.

This video helped me understand a lot of your setup better. I never really understood what you meant by 4 panels for bed. Very nice

 

[gregoryx]

I settled on stand up bike storage and a fixed rear bed, since it can meet our requirement of being able to sit up in bed. Short people = short bikes + short bed + less headroom required. FTW

I do like the idea of being able to lift the bed out of the way to use the van for hauling, but in reality that would probably be very infrequent if at all for us. Plus the way our layout is there wont be a huge advantage to raising the bed. I will probably try to make the bed platform removable to start and see how that goes. No need for regular flexibility for gear storage.

That being said I am a huge fan of flexible configurations, it has been an incredible benefit in our Odysseys for the past 20 years. Don't know how we could have ever done a lot of the stuff he have over the years. In fact, on our last road trip and again just yesterday I ran it with the 3rd row folded into floor and one of the captains chairs removed. Was able to shuttle my parents to my nieces and a few bikes to my brothers in the same milk run.

It's always about finding the model that meets YOUR needs.

The removable bed on our Sprinter served us very well. Three panels that pulled out EASY. The legit queen-sized mattress was the biggest challenge.

But the changing size of the bikes was what got frustrating. First, we'd sized it just-right for whatever bikes. Then the more down-hill rigs came into play and we put in a couple 2x4s to raise it. Eventually, that got to FOUR 2x4s and it was silly. Then taking those in/out seemed a nuisance - sometimes just leave the bed high when we really wanted it low. But our use-case includes 20-somethings - I probably wouldn't buy a new bike if it weren't for them - and potentially kids in it at some point. Adjust-ability this time became a thing. And it just seemed like a COOL thing to do...

The Sprinter 3-panel bed that sat on simple aluminum angles riv-nutted to the walls. And a tray that was comfy for two bikes and squeezed three. Worked awesome. But then the stack of 2x4s kept getting taller... 😁

 

[eranrund]

Will do. I ran out of steam after the last big multi-day, long-hour push and it's waiting in the garage for me to revisit it. Just picked up Some Lexan sheets that I'm going to try to use as the walls.

I will try to flip it over and get some shots of the bottom / drain portion of it shortly. From there, I need to get walls on it before the water side makes any progress; nothing to attach the mixers to at this point!

Thank you! I know how that goes... lots of long days on this type of project.

 

[JMBoise]

It's always about finding the model that meets YOUR needs.

The removable bed on our Sprinter served us very well. Three panels that pulled out EASY. The legit queen-sized mattress was the biggest challenge.

But the changing size of the bikes was what got frustrating. First, we'd sized it just-right for whatever bikes. Then the more down-hill rigs came into play and we put in a couple 2x4s to raise it. Eventually, that got to FOUR 2x4s and it was silly. Then taking those in/out seemed a nuisance - sometimes just leave the bed high when we really wanted it low. But our use-case includes 20-somethings - I probably wouldn't buy a new bike if it weren't for them - and potentially kids in it at some point. Adjust-ability this time became a thing. And it just seemed like a COOL thing to do...

The Sprinter 3-panel bed that sat on simple aluminum angles riv-nutted to the walls. And a tray that was comfy for two bikes and squeezed three. Worked awesome. But then the stack of 2x4s kept getting taller... 😁
View attachment 159712

Hi Gregoryx
I am still up in the air on ordering a cargo van with all around windows or a passenger van. Don't need the seats. Probably will install a two person folding jump seat just behind the driver. My main reason for choosing the passenger van would be the finished ceiling and walls. Not seeing myself being able to do custom side and ceiling installs, but would have to take out existing walls and ceiling for solar install anyways and reinstall. Pretty pricey to have an outfitter install walls and ceiling on cargo package. Pretty much settled on NS set up, climbing over partner in bed would be a big problem with E/W flare set up. Not worried about fishbowl aspect. Privacy glass seems really dark. AC in rear might be a plus. Any tips appreciated. Thanks

 

[njvagabond]

But the changing size of the bikes was what got frustrating

Not an issue for me.

I got a new bike as a 60th b-day present to myself as replacement for my 25 year old Kona. The van will probably be gone before the bike, unless I break the stupid CF frame. My road bike is a 35 year old Bianchi but that's not going in the van. I still occasionally ride my previous generation bikes out of nostalgia, a 45 year old Viscount road and 33 year old GT mtb).

I suspect by the time I buy my next new bike I'll be looking for one with three wheels. 😪 A Bob Jackson racing trike might work. I wonder if ever buit any mixte ones.