[ccrowley96]

Super insightful. Do you think connecting it to CCP1 with a 60A surface mount breaker is feasible? If the Orion software works correctly, it shouldn't be pulling amps when the ignition is off, but the ~12.4V amperage draw is getting really close to the 60A fuse.

I asked a similar question to a tech at BattleBorn batteries (I purchased the Orion through them) and this is what I got in response:

The Orion will be activated when the voltage is increased from the input source so its fine to attach it to the CCP, it doesn’t require an ignition activation. The Orion is a one way device and it will also shut down when the alternator stops charging the start batteries.

That still doesn't really address the fuse sizing issue though.

Based on my setup, how would you recommend properly installing the B2B charger? I really appreciate the input!

 

[ccrowley96]

Oof. Yeah that seems like a pain to replace if blown. I don't have a CCP2. My transit is a 2022 AWD high roof cargo with single battery & only CCP1 (250A alternator). I think the ideal situation would be a surface mount breaker that trips before the under seat fuse blows in case the amperage gets close to 60, but I wasn't able to find a surface mount DC breaker in between 50 amps and 60 amps.

If not using CCP1, sounds like I'd have to go right to the battery. Do you have any resources that you found useful for connecting straight to the battery? How was your install?

Here is a photo of the 60a fuse under the seat, its not a common fuse, and its spot welded in to the bus bar. So if you blow that, the dealership might be the place to get a new one, and you have to drill it out, to add a bolt for reinstall.

Do you not have CCP2?

View attachment 207967

 

[ccrowley96]

In a way you still have CCP2, its just not relayed/fused. In that photo the top arrow is where the 190A CCP2 relay would be connected.
I would connect there and then use a 70a breaker. The breaker would probably even fit in there too.

Amazon.com

Very cool, that top arrow connection point looks pretty doable.

In the BEMM, I found the following notes:

There are notes about loads > 60A requiring 'load shedding'. Do you know if you need to wire into any additional circuitry when not directly using the CCP?

 

[ccrowley96]

So the load shedding is to prevent the alternator from over heating. Basically it wants things to shut off its too much for the alternator. Normally you want to keep the duty cycle under 50% or in our case ~125A.

The engine needs ~20A to operate at idle, (haven't measured while driving) and the AC can take 50A on start up, so that leaves you around 60A which is my assumption on Ford wanting load shredding above 60A.

Gotcha, thanks for that info.

I think my current plan, based on the info you provided, is to tap directly into the post where the CCP2 would have been installed and use a 60 / 70amp surface mount breaker mounted in a more accessible point near that connection.

I'll update this thread with my results.

 

[ccrowley96]

I do like to hear that haha. It would be a lot easier to just tap into CCP1 with a 60A external breaker and call it a day. Hmm curious if there are any other thoughts. So far we've got a 1-1 tie on recommendations.

 

[ccrowley96]

In van building, there are many design choices that can be done with a simple solution or a complex one.

I do agile software development, so the approach I take with most things is to find the simple approach and then iterate when necessary.

You've already got my vote, so I'll just explain. I'd start with the simple, and then only move on to the complex if you find the simple doesn't work out.

The other option leads you to over-engineering at every step, which means you'll never get to 'done'.

Try the breaker, if it doesn't with out, then you've got a plan 'b'. Let us know how it works out.

I like -- also a software dev familiar with Agile. I've def been over thinking too many parts of this build so far. Simplicity is such a beautiful thing.

 

[ccrowley96]

I too came from an Agile SW world - recently retired after 40 years. I take a little different approach though. I love over engineering, as do many (most?) other SW devs. With my van I now have the freedom to spend as much time as I want over analyzing and trying out all sorts of ideas without the 2 week sprint deadlines.

A little pondering in the morning with my coffee around the fire pit, then some rethinking in the afternoon with a little whiskey. Will I ever get the van done? Probably not. But I'll have great fun in the process.

Mix some "analysis paralysis" with "no responsibility". It's truly sublime!

Hahah I love this. Needed to hear it this morning after a particularly difficult espar gas heater install. Sometimes over-engineering is the best way. Thanks for the words : )

 

[ccrowley96]

One of the great features of the new Orion which sets it apart from other DC-DC chargers is fully programmable current limits for both input and output. So... if you want the simplest solution, with no need to remove the seat either now or in the future, set the input current limit to 48A (60A - 20%) and connect to CCP1. The 60A breaker then just functions as a disconnect.

View attachment 208026

I love this option. Thanks for sharing. This seems like the easiest and most effective route.

 

[ccrowley96]

@ccrowley96 - how has the Orion 50A XS connected to the CCP1 worked this summer? I'm in a similar situation - one AGM battery and limited to the CCP1 connection.

It's been great! I programmed the Orion XS to only pull 48 amps to be on the safe side. It pumps about 600 watts into my lithium batteries while the van is running. No issues with the auto start / stop functionality based on the vans ignition state.

Here's a video of my install if you're curious!

Best of luck!