We built our Ford Transit van in October of 2020 and purchased TWO Renogy Lithium-Iron Phosphate Batteries (12 volt/170Ah) for which we paid $3,000. We have put about 30,000 miles on the van taking around 6 road trips across country. We have not turned the batteries off when parked and so they usually stay charged at 100% in California. The batteries are now dead (will not charge above 20%)! This is after just 2.5 years. Is this normal? Naturally the "warranty" has expired. So, if this is normal life for these expensive batteries, then replacement will be equal to $1200 per year which seems insane. Is there a better option in batteries and did we do something wrong? Should we have been turning them off when not in use? Appreciate any advice
Lithium batteries dead after 2 years? Is this normal?
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Duplicate answer to your duplicate post:
Is this normal?
No, it is not normal. But it is possible to destroy or drastically shorten the life of a battery by improper charging or by continuous deep discharging, or by continuous charging and discharging at high ambient temperatures.
The only thing running when not in use is the ICECO fridge.
Why were you running the fridge if you were not using it?
We have not turned the batteries off when parked and so they usually stay charged at 100% in California.
Some will tell you that storing them fully charged will shorten their life. Others will tell you that storing them fully charged is recommended. Storing them fully charged should not shorten their life to 2.5 years.
Should we have been turning them off when not in use?
It would have been better to turn them off, but not turning them off should not have shortened their life to 2.5 years.
Here's what I suspect might have happened:
From your post it sounds like you have solar charging, and you have said that you ran the fridge all the time. You're in California, where it can get hot. So if your batteries were in a hot environment (the solar oven that some refer to as a van) AND they were constantly charging and discharging because your refrigerator was on all the time, that could drastically shorten the life of your batteries.
Is this normal?
No, it is not normal. But it is possible to destroy or drastically shorten the life of a battery by improper charging or by continuous deep discharging, or by continuous charging and discharging at high ambient temperatures.
The only thing running when not in use is the ICECO fridge.
Why were you running the fridge if you were not using it?
We have not turned the batteries off when parked and so they usually stay charged at 100% in California.
Some will tell you that storing them fully charged will shorten their life. Others will tell you that storing them fully charged is recommended. Storing them fully charged should not shorten their life to 2.5 years.
Should we have been turning them off when not in use?
It would have been better to turn them off, but not turning them off should not have shortened their life to 2.5 years.
Here's what I suspect might have happened:
From your post it sounds like you have solar charging, and you have said that you ran the fridge all the time. You're in California, where it can get hot. So if your batteries were in a hot environment (the solar oven that some refer to as a van) AND they were constantly charging and discharging because your refrigerator was on all the time, that could drastically shorten the life of your batteries.
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@kenryan - Well thought out response. The most important question to answer, as you were trying to do, is "Were the batteries defective or where they used / charged incorrectly?" This should be answered as you don't want to buy new batteries have have them crap out right away.
So further questions. Where in CA does the OP live. Nor Cal would be much different than in Palm Springs, heat wise.
Secondly, how do the batteries get recharged? I would assume there are solar panels and some type of charge controller. Were the charge controller settings correct? How are the batteries charged during driving, are these settings correct? Not sure if incorrect settings alone could cause this type of failure. Just asking.
Knowing if the batteries were defective on some level may never be know. However, since I leave my van parked with the fridge on and the solar panels recharging my batteries, I sure would like to know.
First question: What are your charging parameters? What is being used to charge? And have you verified the voltages with a meter?
Second: How did you determine that the batteries are only holding 20%
Off hand, you either were over charging the batteries or you got unlucky. I would charge and test each battery separatly and see what you get. It would be odd to have two batteries die the same way.
As to what is to be expected, we are still pretty early on in LFP use, especially as a house battery. I'd say that those of us with LFP are the guinea pigs at this point. I live off the grid and have switched to LFP and I can tell you there has been a learning curve and it hasn't all been awesome. However, my golf cart, van and home are all running LFP. But those that extoll the virtues of LFP often have very little actual experience. I can say that there is no perfect battery yet.
But for starters, get us more information and then let's go from there.
Second: How did you determine that the batteries are only holding 20%
Off hand, you either were over charging the batteries or you got unlucky. I would charge and test each battery separatly and see what you get. It would be odd to have two batteries die the same way.
As to what is to be expected, we are still pretty early on in LFP use, especially as a house battery. I'd say that those of us with LFP are the guinea pigs at this point. I live off the grid and have switched to LFP and I can tell you there has been a learning curve and it hasn't all been awesome. However, my golf cart, van and home are all running LFP. But those that extoll the virtues of LFP often have very little actual experience. I can say that there is no perfect battery yet.
But for starters, get us more information and then let's go from there.
We have 2 solar panels (also Renogy)We are in inland San Diego area. Van is parked in driveway, uncovered. We have two 200 Watt 12 Volt Monocrystalline Solar Panels (also Renogy). For the past 2.5 years, while van is parked in our driveway and only running fridge, we are always at 99-100%. Even while using the van, it has never dropped below 60%. My husband unhooked the batteries from the van, then charged each battery separately with a separate battery charger (Renogy) and got each one up to 100% then put them back in the van and they each quickly dropped down to 20% within 24 hours.
This all started last week, when we noticed that instead of 99-100% charged we were suddenly in the 60's with no use. It was very sunny for 2-3 days straight and yet not charging. So... he was able to charge batteries to 100% but when reinstalled they quickly lost the charge (24+ hours). Could this be the panels and not the batteries?
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It is also possible that the problem is not the batteries at all, but rather some other part of your system that is causing a large and/or continuous draw on your batteries, overpowering your charging capabilities. It is also possible that your charging capabilities have been diminished for some reason. Either of these possibilities can be verified or ruled out by observing your charge and discharge rates.
What controls the charge from the panels into the batteries and what are the parameters (voltages) set to?
And you need to confirm that those voltages are making it to the batteries and are correct,
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@kenryan is on to something. The first thing to understand is that determining lithium battery SOC by measuring battery voltage for Lithium batteries is virtually impossible. This is because the voltage curve of a Lithium battery is essentially flat. The only way to know total charge is by monitoring the total net current draw taken out of the battery over time, or net energy in or out.
Once the battery gets towards 100% SOC voltage climbs very quickly. It is pretty much only at this point that you know that the battery is 100%. Same thing at the low end of SOC, when voltage drops aggressively.
Maybe your shunt that is reading net energy is not working correctly? Maybe the software that manages the shunt doesn't show the correct battery size? Maybe the SOC shows 20% but it is not. The point is that you can't at this point rely upon the shunt based system to determine SOC. You will probably need to take a battery out. Charge it fully and then attach a high draw electrical appliance and calculate how many watt hours you really get out of the battery.
Since these batteries cost $1,500 a piece, I might suggest spending $45 on the tester in the video below. Charge the battery up all the way. Hook up the tester and in about 8 hours you will have a reading on each battery.
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