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My 1974 Fiat 128 was bulletproof. Not literally, but figuratively. It would not die. Unless it burned up too much oil and the engine would stop, but I'd add a quart and start it up and take off. Try running your Transit without oil until the motor stops and see what happens. It would be an interesting experiment, and a great story to share.

But really, as mentioned above, different specs and sizes and construction for different requirements. I don't know where the "DucatoMaster is cheaper" came from, when I was ready to buy the ProRam was actually MORE than a similar Transit. They started out cheaper, but something happened.
Fast forward to the 21st century. Fiat has the worst build quality this side of a Yugo. They will soon stop selling them here in the US I suspect. Dodge and Jeep are also bottom dwellers. Ford is right at the top. Ford took a hit for a a few years from the issues with the Microsoft infotainment debacle, but seem to have gotten over that.
 

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The PM is a car chassis and front wheel drive train..... it's a car. The Transit is a rear wheel drive truck. They each appeal to different people but I think over the very long haul, a truck will last longer.
Curious which car chassis is it made on?
 

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The PM is a car chassis and front wheel drive train..... it's a car. The Transit is a rear wheel drive truck. They each appeal to different people but I think over the very long haul, a truck will last longer.
Hmmm.. One of these is a unibody construction and shares its motor and drivetrain with several cars made by the same manufacturer, and the other is a unibody construction and shares its motor and drivetrain with several cars made by the same manufacturer..

Yeah, that's a big difference.
 

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Brand loyalty is a character trait of people in the "helpless" graph of stupidity. Even people with high IQ or many college degrees can be stupid; defined most aptly as doing things that hurt/impede others without any benefit to themselves. There are other forms of stupid, "helpless" being one in which others gain at their expense.
 

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Brand loyalty is a character trait of people in the "helpless" graph of stupidity
Absolutely, though I would modify it to blind brand loyalty. while that is bad enough, it gets even worse when such loyalty has to be affirmed by bashing every other brand.

The clearest example is teenage boys who have a given brand of 4wd and have to declare that all the others will self-destruct even though there are hundreds of thousands of them on the road.
 

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Most service vans use a ladder rack.

Work smarter not harder. I got the HR with intentions of not needing a ladder to get a ladder.

You all can find reasons why to keep your stuff inside vs. outside.

I can hang a 32' extension ladder to the ceiling and do 3rd story work.

Pictured is a 24' extension ladder & a 12 step ladder hanging from the ceiling.

I still have over a 6' clearance to walk around inside.
 

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The lack of an adjustable steering column on the Promaster was a deal breaker for me. Also Transit had slightly more interior height.

Initially I was set on the Promaster because of less overall height and length, plus some hearsay about better fuel economy.
 

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Ford parts suppliers and build quality is abismal. How are they producing vans in 2019 with leaking roofs? Leaking airbox. Water on engine and ecm.

Fuel pump driver modules leaving you stranded

Exhaust manifolds warping

Throttle body plastic gears stripping

My turbo is screaming at 84000 miles. Still don't know why

Horrible ergonomics and seats. Really poor engineering designed to meet the lowest common denominator

I can only blame myself for building my house in a vehicle designed to be disposable.
 

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My 1974 Fiat 128 was bulletproof. Not literally, but figuratively. It would not die. Unless it burned up too much oil and the engine would stop, but I'd add a quart and start it up and take off. Try running your Transit without oil until the motor stops and see what happens. It would be an interesting experiment, and a great story to share.

But really, as mentioned above, different specs and sizes and construction for different requirements. I don't know where the "DucatoMaster is cheaper" came from, when I was ready to buy the ProRam was actually MORE than a similar Transit. They started out cheaper, but something happened.
Fast forward to the 21st century. Fiat has the worst build quality this side of a Yugo. They will soon stop selling them here in the US I suspect. Dodge and Jeep are also bottom dwellers. Ford is right at the top. Ford took a hit for a a few years from the issues with the Microsoft infotainment debacle, but seem to have gotten over that.
Ford paid to be listed at the top. Must have.
 

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This comparison would be more interesting if FCA offered the Ducato high-roof body as a ProMaster.

Initially I assumed the Mexican Fiat Ducato plant didn’t need the high roof, but once exporting to US and Canada, I can’t follow why no H3 roof in North America. Maybe there isn’t enough demand for 7-foot ceiling height when 6’-4” is also available. :s
 

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This thread, like many others, begs the question....
Why do so many people, who evidently hate FOMOCO and everything they ever built, own Transits?
I don't hate Ford, I just recognize what is. Am I not allowed to point out the shortcomings of the vehicle once I own it? If that's a rule... No wonder so many fan bois

I love the Boss 302 Laguna Seca Mustang.

The reason I own a transit is it was the only used high roof extended wheelbase van in my area

I knew it would have pain points going in. Just some of them are surprising

Just because I knew ford sucks before buying one doesn't mean I won't complain about it 🙂
 

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This thread, like many others, begs the question....
Why do so many people, who evidently hate FOMOCO and everything they ever built, own Transits?
1. Because they can't afford to buy/maintain a Sprinter
2. Because the Transit is the best choice for the money
3. Because of some incorrect and ultimately misguided protectionism re: "Buy Merikun"
4. Because they hate all two of the other options more than the Transit
 

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This thread, like many others, begs the question....
Why do so many people, who evidently hate FOMOCO and everything they ever built, own Transits?
Lesser of three evils... I don't hate my Transit, but I dislike it the least for various reasons. I think the Sprinter is probably a better build quality, and it is most certainly a safer vehicle in an accident, but I have only one dealer within 100 miles and I wouldn't be able to afford the maintenance on it. If the 4 cylinder Sprinter with the 7 speed tranny had been available when I was shopping I would have probably gone that route despite the labour costs at the local MB dealer, but when they dropped that engine from their lineup I went looking at Ford and Promaster. Promaster wasn't quite tall enough inside for my needs, the tow rating was not quite what I needed, and they dropped the diesel when I was shopping. I didn't like the high revving V6 gas motor when going down a hill in the Promaster. The tranny programing was set to drop out of overdrive into 5th going down a hill at Interstate speeds to prevent the vehicle from speeding up too much. Apparently someone at FCA thinks engine components and transmissions cost less than brake pads.

For my needs, the Transit was the best choice. I keep hoping Hyundai and Toyota will bring their commercial van to the US or that GM will team up with Iveco and start bringing in their full size vans. But with GM selling more Savana / Express vans than the Promaster AND Sprinter combined, I don't see them changing that van very soon.
 

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Lesser of three evils... .....cut......
Agree 100%. Except for me it’s the lesser of 4 evils.

I also had the choice to spend way too much on my existing Econoline hoping to buy enough time for some of the deficiencies you mention to be addressed, corrected, or whatever.

Sprinter is expensive, narrow, and diesel. There are fewer dealers and new small gasoline turbo engine may or may not hold up under hard work.

ProMaster has close to ideal size but transmission gearing is horrendous, hardly better than a 4-speed in highway driving. I’m also not crazy about transverse V6s, although my Honda has been excellent so far.

Transit is narrower, seats don’t swivel, roof height is either a bit too low or way taller than I need, and parking brake location makes me think that designers were high because it’s about as dumb as possible. Seats are a bit too close to each other also for my taste.

I’ve been hanging on trying to keep van running but it’s getting more expensive than buying new one.

If forced today I would buy an extended ProMaster, but I’m hoping the 2020 Model Year Transit will sway me. The Devil is in the details (and pricing), so I’m waiting to see swivel seats, and whether moving to back is easier than at present. Higher towing capacity could also be a plus — let’s see where ratings end up.
 

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GapRunr, you and I must have been shopping at the same time. When I ruled-out the gas-3.6 Promaster based on quality and reliability problems, they stopped making the diesel Promaster. I liked the Transit and think it's a far better van than the Promaster, but ultimately I preferred the 4 cyl/7-speed Sprinter, not to mention it was quite a few thousand cheaper than a diesel Transit. (Right time/right place? I dunno.)

I ordered mine and must have received one of the very last MB 4 cyl Sprinters made. They tagged it a 2016 even though it was built in Dec 2016, allowing me to get the $3,000 in MB close-out rebates, but I fell within this 11-day window where I was able to get it with 2017 options not previously available on a 2016 (factory swivel seats, leather steering wheel, to name a couple). Had I played around another week, I would not have been able to get a 4 cyl at all. My luck usually works the other way, but count my blessings this time!

If Toyota imported a diesel van I would be all over it. My Toyota SUVs have been as bulletproof as everyone claims.
 

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and parking brake location makes me think that designers were high because it’s about as dumb as possible.
Wait till you try to slide out of a Promaster this summer wearing shorts and your shorts leg gets stuck on the left side parking brake. Your head will hit the ground before your feet do...

With the low cost of electronic parking brakes, I can't understand why manufactures still deal with all the mechanical crap, y cables, adjustments, etc. of a manual parking brake.
 

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and parking brake location makes me think that designers were high because it’s about as dumb as possible.
Wait till you try to slide out of a Promaster this summer wearing shorts and your shorts leg gets stuck on the left side parking brake. Your head will hit the ground before your feet do...

With the low cost of electronic parking brakes, I can't understand why manufactures still deal with all the mechanical crap, y cables, adjustments, etc. of a manual parking brake.
Just noting that electronic controlled parking brake still uses mechanical crap, cables, and adjustments.
 
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