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Discussion Starter #1
I don't want to start a war but, how many people are interested in the diesel only? Unlike the Promaster I think Ford plans to sell a lot of the 3.2 diesel models.

Lynn
 

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No war but one of my primary reasons for considering buying a Transit is to get rid of the diesel Sprinter. If you do a little arithmetic you will find very little operational savings with a diesel at todays fuel prices. Gas engine has a lot less emission equipment compared to a modern diesel. It will be interesting to see the mpg ratings of the gas and diesel engines in the Transit so accurate operational cost differences can be calculated.
 

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I'd get another diesel Sprinter before I'd take a chance on a brand new diesel in a brand new Ford.
My primary reason for being interested in the Transit is to replace my V6 diesel Sprinter with something that is simpler, cheaper, and more predictable to own and operate. That's why I'm even a bit leary of the Ecoboost and it's turbo complexity.
Ford has to worry about it's CAFE numbers, I have to manage my own time as well as personal finances.
I'm just hoping the planet can heal itself regarding any increased hydrocarbons I may burn as a result of looking after my own bottom line.
 

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No more diesels for me, I have 2 at the moment a C7 Cat and a 6.0 powerstroke, both have been great but the cost of the fuel is insane and will remain so.
The Ecoboost is a solid engine, have one with 50k miles on it with zero issues.
The other headache with diesel is running Espar heaters...**** fuel gels at minus 30 and makes them unpredictable when you really need them...the gas versions work fine at that temperature.
 

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No more diesels for me
Same here, as sad as that is to say... According to my math, with a $4000 premium and added fuel costs, it would probably NEVER break even during the life of the motor...


The other headache with diesel is running Espar heaters...**** fuel gels at minus 30 and makes them unpredictable when you really need them...the gas versions work fine at that temperature.
and wait, a gasoline fueled espar heater!!?? That was one of the lingering annoyances I had regarding selling my sprinter for a gas powered transit or promaster - the need for a separate diesel tank. GAS HEATER - DUH!

I'm off to google!
 

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At least here in California it seems that diesel is being taxed more and more over gasoline. I think because it's regarded as a "commercial" fuel. I don't see this trend reversing any time soon.

So then the economy of the diesel is negated, even if there were enough miles driven to justify the +$5000 engine option. I can still see a couple advantages, namely the higher miles-to-empty due to the higher energy content (better MPG) of diesel fuel, and the increased engine life due to the lubrication properties of diesel.
 

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....the increased engine life due to the lubrication properties of diesel.
My first and only diesel was my '08 Sprinter, but as far as I can tell the lubricity thing was trashed when ultra low sulfur was introduced. Others here may have more insight.
 

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I drove a 1981 VW Diesel 110k 1981-1990 when I bought a gas Passat. I never had a problem finding fuel and driving from SoCal to northern MN only filled up twice enroute. I did have the auxiliary 10 gallon gas tank a total of 20 gallons on board. I never had a bit of problems with that diesel engine and got 45-55 mpg on the highway and 40-45 in town.

Ford has been building this 3.2L 5 cylinder diesel in South Africa since the early 1990s and this is the fourth or fifth generation? Our engines are built in South Africa and imported. I like how the Federalized engine exhaust is only pure nitrogen and water vapor. Diesel is less dangerous to carry, it takes a lot more to ignite compared to gasoline. One thing the latest I read this diesel is Federalized and passes smog in 49 states but not in California as yet.

I will not buy a new American built vehicle, 1964-1/2 Mustang and 1967 Chrysler cured me of that. My van purchase is at least a year or two away since American built vehicles often have teething problems. I try to buy two years old. I read reviews and posts about problems people have and make up my mind. I bought a 1981 E150 with 80k in 1983 and drove it until 1997 and 285k. I am driving a 1995 F150 I bought in 1997 with 26k and now have 156.5k. I wanted another E150 but there were none 2 years old when I needed new wheels. I want to trade this F150 in soon but it will last another few years.

OTOH I have bought brand new late 60s Datsun 510 and a 1973 Subaru, and four VW's 1963 bug, 1976 gas Rabbit, 1981 diesel Rabbit and 1990 gas Passat and had few problems mostly minor or at least taken care of.

Greg Hayden
 

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Your diesels are what sold me on diesel.
Modern low emission diesels are what scared me away.
I'm guessing that if you can afford the down time during limp home mode as well as the repairs and replacements to the add-ons that make them burn clean then all is well.
I'm too timid for that.
 

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.....cut..... It will be interesting to see the mpg ratings of the gas and diesel engines in the Transit so accurate operational cost differences can be calculated.
Won't Transits be exempt from EPA ratings? Regardless, MPG can't be that great for any conventional vehicle that weighs up to 5500 pounds empty and has so much frontal area. The difference between gasoline and diesel MPG will depend in part on type of driving, and EPA can't know that for each of us anyway.
 

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I am not an expert on diesel. I had an Isuzu I-Mark diesel in the 80's and it was great. It cost an extra $600 and got 50-55 MPG highway. This was double the gas version and diesel was less expensive than gas at the time. In the 10 years I had it I replaced a timing belt and starter motor (not including brakes and battery).


Here is my take today:


1. Diesel engines are very complex and there is a high price premium.

2. Diesel engines in the US are focused on torque not MPG. Ford Europe has much smaller diesel engines focused on MPGs.

3. Gas engines have gotten much more efficient making diesels much harder to justify.

4. Diesel highway MPG is better while city MPG is marginally better.

5. Diesel repairs are more expensive.


I have done a detailed cost analysis and in my case it never pays back (15K/miles/yr). I don't need the torque.

I also did this for CNG and it doesn't payback either.
 

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and wait, a gasoline fueled espar heater!!?? That was one of the lingering annoyances I had regarding selling my sprinter for a gas powered transit or promaster - the need for a separate diesel tank. GAS HEATER - DUH!

I'm off to google!
You want the 'b' series...like a B4 Airtronic
 

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Yesterday filled Sprinter with diesel. Just in a few weeks the cost difference between gas and diesel has changed from 40 cents/gallon to today's 20 cents/gallon. So your operational cost comparison can change quickly.
In my case I simply do not want all the extra emission hardware/software that a diesel now requires to meet the regulations. I do not even want the EcoBoost because of all the extra hardware. I do not need to go fast in a van.
The longer life of a diesel engine does not apply to me. At my age of 75 years old any engine will outlast me. Besides if the diesel engine lasts twice long as a gas engine but costs twice as much to replace, the overall cost is the same. I can buy a used 3.7 gas engine for about $2500 if it needs replacing.
 

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There are a lot of opinions here so I'll add my own.

First, there are no "right" or wrong answers. Each user is going to have a different set of requirements and a different usage profile that will impact their decision, so there is no need to state matter of factly that one approach is better or worse than another.

Second, one reason Ford is bringing the Transit to the U.S. is Mulally's push for a "global" Ford. No more North American specific vehicles when you can leverage global development resources and spread R&D across a global platform... that is why we are getting a "global" Transit platform in the U.S. As such, we are also getting the global engine, which is (among others) the 3.2 diesel. Anywhere outside the U.S. the diesel to petrol spread is negated by the fact that overall fuel prices are two to three times higher. As such, the extra BTUs in every gallon of diesel are precious and is makes economic sense.

Lastly, Ford is also looking at their competition and I think they are convinced they "have" to have a diesel option, because the PM and the Sprinter do too, not because they think its the best choice for U.S. consumers. All told, I would wager that the vast majority of diesel purchases in the U.S. are fleet purchasers who have specs that require diesel for various reasons, whether it is fleet mileage, aux load requirements, homologous fuel specs, etc.

For me, I'm leaning toward the ecoboost because I need to tow and I take trips at altitude and need the forced air induction to compensate. I have a 2.0 ecoboost in my Edge that has performed well with 40k miles, and Ford now has a VAST amount of experience with the 3.5L ecoboost since it has 3+ years of operational history in the best selling vehicle in North America, the F-150. If that engine had major problems or reliability issues, we would know by now. There are simply too many of them out there collecting miles for their durability to be unknown.

Anyway, rambling... golly I hope I can see one of these things in person soon. I need the Transit wagon to be nice, or else I'm going to end up in a Nissan NV and I really don't want to drive that fugly van!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The ecoboost I believe is over 1800 $ more than the 3.7 and gets less MPG. How do you justify that? The ecoboost is turbo charged , making it more complicated. If you don't like a complicated diesel then why buy the more complicated ecoboost. I'm confused.

Lynn
 

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I want to add that there is quite the diesel fallacy which is leading to borderline unbrilded infatuation. See europe has such a well definted diesel market because they're paying almost double for petrol vs diesel.

Here where we pay MORE for diesel than for petrol, plus the ridiculous equipment needed to make the diesels compliant with emissions regs any and all mileage gains are washed out because of excessive costs.

don't forget to add in DEF, particulate filters, more frequent oil changes and more oil needed per change....
 

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The ecoboost I believe is over 1800 $ more than the 3.7 and gets less MPG. How do you justify that? The ecoboost is turbo charged , making it more complicated. If you don't like a complicated diesel then why buy the more complicated ecoboost. I'm confused.

Lynn
Good way to put it.
Not sure which one i'd prefer that would be the least complicated.
 
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